The MP starter kit - what should it include?

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The MP starter kit - what should it include?

Postby Ishmae1 » March 2nd, 2017, 9:27 pm

Hi all,

We're currently putting together the "MP starter kit", which is a 2-school arsenal case and a collection of skills to get players immediately started in MP and give them a little taste of the different kinds of decks they can build in Phantom Dust.

Because of the way save data is initialized for a new player in the original game, we can't just give this to everyone automatically, but we can put a free DLC offer up for Phantom Dust that contains the stuff we want (and we'll have a way to let players know about it and to go and get it -- don't worry) that anyone can download to jump right into MP.

So I ask y'all: what should it contain?

We're leaning towards a smattering of 30 total common to uncommon skills from Optical, Psycho, and Nature -- around 8 to 10 from each -- generally giving you the kind of starter options you had in the campaign game, but we're not limited to specifically those skills alone. It should contain a few not immediately obvious skills, but also some standards (bullet of fire, laser, psycho knife, etc.) that are fairly straightforward in their use.

So here's your chance to chime in on what it should contain!

I'm also hoping that once this is locked down, some of the community will rise to the challenge of making some tutorial videos around decks you can create from this set, and how to play them. Just sayin' :)

Ish / Adam

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Postby Ben » March 2nd, 2017, 10:15 pm

The arsenal builder can be found here: http://phantomdusted.com/arsenal-lab/#/arsenal/create

I don't remember my exact arsenal sadly, but I do remember a good ol' 3 hit combo that was extremely fun to land!

Get yourself up to 10 or more Aura and you're in for some fun if you can land it! Catch them on the stairs for Highway, hit them on the escalators for Palace, or trap them on the thin ledges of Refinery!

Twister + Backdraft Bullet + Pursuit is so satisfying to pull off for 10 damage.

Image

Entangle in case you just want to run Twister + Pursuit or Backdraft Bullet instead of both.

Otherwise, take some pot shots with Sonic Boom or switch to a little closer style with Lighting Speed + Hyperkick + Vacuum Slash and a defense.

A Healing Water just in case you're hurting while waiting for the right orbs.

Disclaimer: This was just a fun deck, not a play to win deck. I cannot vouch for the viability of it in play yet!
Arsenal builder created by forum user: oltranzista
Last edited by Ben on March 3rd, 2017, 12:01 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby Bloodpool » March 2nd, 2017, 10:57 pm

Here are some that I think are new player friendly and effective;
Rock Shot
Bomb
Psycho Spear
Psycho Sniper
Psycho Blade
Psycho Burst
Crystal Wall
About Face
Reverse
Psycho Shell
Psychic Wall
Dazzle
Pressure

Blaster
Laser
Triple Laser
Photon Wave
Laser Blade
Vibration Blaster
Photon Barrier
Flash Barrier
Paralyze Barrier
Relearn
Level amp

Bullet of Fire
Twister
Vacuum Slash
Fang of Tree
Thunder Storm
Flame Sword
Ice Sword
Rain of Rocks
Glacial Wall
Fortress of Iron
Wall of Fire
Wall of Current
Heat
Entangle
Healing Water
Return to Nature

I think the best idea is to not spread things out too much, but still give them some variety. I do like your idea of giving them a 2 school arsenal case with 3 schools to choose from.
Last edited by Bloodpool on March 2nd, 2017, 11:21 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Postby WILD WEASEL » March 2nd, 2017, 10:58 pm

Hey Adam,

I'm really excited about these new possibilities and would like to help in bringing as many new players to this game as i can.
I have compiled a list that is pretty basic but does offer some complexity, it also has all the different types of skills and various angels of attack.
Hope this helps...


Psycho:
Bomb, Psycho Kinesis, Gravity Press, Reverse, Psycho Spear, Speed Up, Dazzle, Psycho Shell, Pressure, Shatter.


Nature:
Vacuum Slash, Flame Sword, Twister, Fortress of Iron, Purify, Thunderstorm, Heat, Healing Water, Bullet of Fire, Ice Sword, Optical Camo, Glacial Wall.


Optical:
Photon Burst, Triple Lasers, Rapid Cannon, Vibration Blaster, Eraser, Optimization, Photon Barrier, Killer Satellite.
Thanks for all your hard work and dedication on this project, it will be great!
Daniel.

p.s. any word on a release date???

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Postby Collected Dust » March 3rd, 2017, 5:36 am

I'm having a little trouble in getting the intent exactly. Is it for variety or effectiveness for beginners?

My Attempts

Stay Safe Shields - All shields can block any move going against them making defense simple.

Fortress of Iron
Psycho Shell
Psychic Wall
Wall of Fire
Glacial Wall - Useful Bonus
Reflect Shield - Not a great shield but has fun factor and easier to start with compared to Reverse.


Psycho - Wanted to go Bravery Stuff but beginners could mishandle Bravery Decision. Some big damage moves is the alternative

Rock Shot - Gets people eventually
Psycho Spear - Strong 8 damage
Impact Burst - Fun and Easy to use
Psycho Burst - Big Damage for a new player
Dazzle - Easy to Stun with, and combo
Sensor Mine - Unique type. Not sure if Remote Mine helps beginners realize zoning benefits mines give.
Shatter - Neat erase and easy to pay for.
Shields Slayer - simple enough helper.


Looking at Optical - I think the Vibration attacks are good for beginners but building up to 10 level complicates things. The simpler alternative would be Aura Cannon possibly. (Still a little complex)

Optical
Photon Wave or Photon Burst
Slide Laser - Easy to use.
Blaster - Easy to use
Level Amp or Quantum Amp for Psycho Burster
Aura Cannon - A more powerful and accurate attack with simpler restrictions than Vibration moves.
Optimization - Demonstrates Spam Power



Nature - Perhaps the simplest to work with is Memory of Battle. Players use up their attacks and benefit for it. Can get good single use moves out of Nature and Psycho

Memory of battle - Gets more powerful as beginners tend to lose moves quicker. Single use attacks between Nature and Psycho look pretty good.
Bullet of Fire
Vacuum Slash
Flame Sword
Sonic Boom
Tree of Fang
Thunderstorm
Heat
Healing Water
Return to Nature

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Postby Bregan123 » March 3rd, 2017, 12:48 pm

If they are just some easy-to-use arsenals for getting into MP, I'd just go with some of the basic trope decks.

Have a Faith/Nature featuring strong shields and some healing with health sacrifice abilities.
Roughly something like-

1x Flame Sword
1x Bullet of Fire
1x Reincarnation
1x Fire of Gehenna
1x Demon's Fire
2x Agonies of Death
1x Flash Hole
1x Fortress of Iron
1x Dark Hole
1x Vacuum Wall
2x Healing Water
2x Heat

Another could be a Ki/Optic designed to use dash and Tiger's Strength with lasers.

1x Slide Laser
1x Triple Laser
1x Vibration Laser
1x Hyper Kick
1x Photon Burst
1x Blaster
1x Vibration Blaster
2x Eraser
1x Guard
1x Dash
2x Tiger's Strength
1x Optimization
2x Relearn

Another could be a more melee/harass-focused Psycho/Nature buff build.

1x Flame Sword
1x Psycho Knife
1x Sensor Mine
1x Rock Shot
1x Psycho Spear
1x Gravity Press
1x Vacuum Slash
1x Psycho Shell
1x Glacial Wall
1x Fortress of Iron
2x Heat
2x Acquisition
1x Purify


All fairly straightforward arsenals, not necessarily fine-tuned, but solid for combat. I figure new players could dig into erase, environmentals, and some of the more complicated build styles later, but you don't have to use the weird arsenals like they had in Quick-mode back in the day.

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Postby KingDavid73 » March 3rd, 2017, 1:06 pm

I agree that there should be basic skills, but also a decent variety. Like at least one shot, one parabola, explosion, arc, fall, crawl, etc, etc, etc - one sword/melee, etc. Some unlimited use, some single/not unlimited. For defense - same thing, simple ones, but a variety hinting to the new users that there is a lot of depth if they want to keep digging. You don't want it to be too basic / simple / boring. Maybe throw in 1-2 rare/weird skills so new users can have an idea of what they can unlock. Maybe like also at least one of each type of skill (1 status, 1 erase, 1 environmental, 1 special) - just to show new people that they exist.

The hope is that after a couple games, they'll be getting more skills to try out. This first selection of skills should have a decent representation of the types of skills in the game.... but you also don't want to overwhelm the new people... yeah - that's a hard balance to find. Definitely have all the super basic stuff, but I think a couple more complex skills to start with will help new people start experimenting.

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Postby Mista Wicket » March 3rd, 2017, 2:53 pm

I think the following attacks will help point new players in the right direction of arsenal building by showing sub-archtypes aside from just building based off a school: Compressor, Memory of Battle,

At the same time, Bundled laser, Crystalization, and Dance of Death can show offensive benefits of sticking to a specific school. They all encourage a specific skill or type type to realize potential.

I also think Level Amp or Boost Mine would be beneficial in allowing players to try out some of the more aura taxing skills.

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Postby iDooM » March 3rd, 2017, 6:19 pm

One of my very first arsenals: Annoy your opponent with Gungir while your team mate plummets on the enemy. Buff Gungir with a stimulate and/or heat.


Attack:
1x Flamesword
1x Bullet of fire
2x Gungir
1x Blaster
1x Photon Burst
1x Side Laser
2x Vacuum Slash

Defence:
1x Photon Barrier
1x Glacial Wall
1x Gust

Status:
1x Heat
1x Stimulate

Erase:
Purify

Arsenal is meant to be played in standard matches*
Last edited by iDooM on March 3rd, 2017, 6:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby iDooM » March 3rd, 2017, 6:37 pm

This arsenal requires patience. The goal is to lure the enemy into your mines and spears as you follow up with gravity presses.

Attack:
2x Sensor Mines
3x Gravity Press
2x Psycho Spear
1x Psycho Knife
1x Excalibur
1x Blazing Bullet

Defence:
2x Psycho Wall
1x Glacial Wall

Status:
3x Acquisition

Erase:
1x Purifty

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Postby Noobslayer0220 » March 3rd, 2017, 8:27 pm

These are the best skills i think you guys can agree with for a starter kit. It has everything in one, meaning that it has every attack type the game has to offer (except mines) at the lowest rarity i can find for you. Every new player will get a taste of everything.

Psycho school
1. Psycho knife (Blade attack)
2. Rock shot (Parabola)
3. Power (Throws a Object)
4. Rain of Rocks (Rain, Same as a fall effect)
5. Gravity Press (Hole)
6. Crystal Wall (Barrier)
7. Power Shell (Shelter)
8. Bend (Course)
9. Teleportation (Teleport to start location)
10. Levitate (Levitate 30 ft in the air for 15 secs.)

Optical School
1. Laser Blade (Blade Attack)
2. Photon Wave (Explodes Around Self)
3. Laser (Arc)
4. Rapid Cannon (can be spammed)
5. Ricochet Laser (Bounces off Objects)
6. Flash Barrier (Barrier)
7. Reflect barrier (Reflect)
8. Laser Shell (Shell)
9. Level Amp (Increase level by 2)
10. Level Boost (doubles your level, Req >10 level)

Nature School
1. Flame Sword (Blade Attack)
2. Sonic Boom (Arc)
3. Root of Tree (crawl)
4. Twister (Move)
5. Bullet of Fire (Normal Straight Shot)
6. Wall of Fire (Barrier)
7. Fortress of Iron (Shelter)
8. Gust (Course)
9. Entangle (Crawl, Prevents movement and skill use for 3 secs)
10. Healing water (Restores 5 health)
Last edited by Noobslayer0220 on March 6th, 2017, 8:26 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Postby it's revan » March 4th, 2017, 1:43 am

are you looking for just some suuuuuper basic "here's a few okay attacks, a few okay defenses, maybe a Fancy Status Skill" arsenal or are we talking "hey here's some strategies the game has that you can tackle"

like do you want a good old fashioned Bravery Decision arsenal? a saucy Dragon Slayer -> Lack -> Heat from Void number? maybe a Oh Hey These Vibration X Skills Are Stupidly Strong piece?

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Postby ElD » March 4th, 2017, 1:31 pm

Bregan123 wrote:a list of bregan's suggested arsenals
...only one rock shot??? You feelin' ok? :P

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Postby Bregan123 » March 4th, 2017, 3:00 pm

Hey, they're a list of arsenals I suggest for new players, not arsenals I'd design for myself.

Besides....


Bregan123 wrote:btw an even better arsenal is: 15x rockshot and 15 aura!!!!!!!

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Postby Nick » March 5th, 2017, 12:17 am

Awesome idea adam!

I guess the balance you have to find is between too many good skills and too many bad ones. I think skills along the lines of what you gave as examples are perfect.

Psycho:
Psycho Knife
Psycho Spear
About Face
Surprise Attack
Skywalk
Wall
Bomb

Optical:
Laser
Blaster
Laser Shell
Restrain
Level Amp
Gungnir

Nature:
Bullet of Fire
Root of Tree
Twister
Wall of Fire
Wall of Current
Return to Nature
Heat

Something like that. a difficult puzzle for sure though. Personally I wouldn`t include many if any enviros. Optimization is maybe an exception. ARGHAGRHHARG thinking about this makes me want to mod the game really badly - so many skills could exist but don`t.

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